quigonejinn

- fic about how being stretched thin/population decline has affected the Jedi, idea from Imadra.

:D

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It would, you know. I think it probably changed Jedi selectivity about the kinds of missions that they'd send their people on, and it probably politicized the entire process immensely. :> It might be possible to speculate that's when the Order really started getting into bed with the Chancellor's office -- that's where the really vital assignments are going to be, in a sense, but yeah.

Interesting stuff, there.

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Oh, I agree, but the Jedi's reactive philosophy didn't really help matters, imho. Then again, proactive can be just as bad. No matter what, my impression from reading some summaries from Lucas is that the Jedi's protection to the galaxy had made it so spoiled, that the Republic was being eaten away from within and the Jedi weren't able to sotp that. They were, after all, mortal.

(deleted comment)

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I'm not familiar with Gibbon, but keep in mind I've been out of college for years because of financial difficulty, so I'm hardly overeducated.

Well, I'm basing what I said off the introduction to the Clone Wars novels that was written by Lucas himself. He basically states that the Republic was corrupt because the Jedi had offered it too much peace and protection. My impression was that Palaptine took advantage of this and totally swung it in his favor acerbated circumstances. Things would have to be really looked at hard to see if the Republic would have survived if the Jedi had and the Sith defeated by RotS. It could go either way. And Anakin, for all his faults, had a point about someone taking charge and getting people to listen in AotC. I believe that could have helped the Republic. Unfortunately, the guy who did that was UNREDEEMABLY EVIL. XD

I should dig that intro up and type it into LJ for others' reading perusal, to see if maybe I'm reading it wrong or something.

Ahahaha, you're fine. I should be writing Batman Begins pr0n, right now. *slinks off to make Bruce and Ducard do naughty things*

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'Too much peace and protection'? pffft.

How about the fact that it's a society, and societies advance, flower, and decline in predictable cycles. Ten thousand years of stability is quite an achievement.

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Hey, don't look at me. XD I agree with you in theory and practice, but these were Lucas's thoughts, not mine. I'm gonna type it up so you guys can see it and decide for yourself.

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That comment was too wanky and pointless to live. It suffices to say that I'm not sure that the Republic would have fallen if Anakin hadn't gone ebil. Mace was kickin' Palpatine's ass pretty hardcore for a while, and who knows how much longer the Empire would have held together if the Sith hadn't been around to stir the drink? Sure, the Jedi might have ended up being kind of awful semi-dictators, but you wouldn't have had the Death Star, and you probably would have kept the semblance of parliamentary government.

I cannot believe that I spent that much time wanking about some dude's theory of Roman history and then spelled his name wrong. CHRIST. SHOOT ME NOW.

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... although a quick Google shows I may not have spelled it wrong after all. DAMN THOSE TERMINAL S'S. I should just go to bed right now.

*does*

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Well, I already commented, but I didn't think you were wanky. Then again, I'm not really familiar with Roman history. I confess to being undereducated at this point (but going back to school next year! *cheers*).

Oh, I don't think it would automatically have fallen, I just think there was something wrong with it beyond Palpatine, and Palpatine just took advantage of it.

*pets and doesn't shoot*

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gadsflj ahahah. It has nothing to do with being undereducated, my friend, and far, far, far more to do with the fact that I am pretentious bitch who like sto pretend that I know more than I actually do.

Anybody who isn't quite as nice as you or who actually knows what the fuck they're talking about re: Roman history would read this conversation would be like "Who is this Quiggie bitch, and does she actually have more than two brain cells to rub together on a frosty night?"

BED. NOW. *FALLS IN, WISHES YOU GOOD LUCK ON THE ~~QUI-GO~~ DUCARD/BATSY*

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I didn't see anything particularly pretentious in your comment, and nothing bitchy. Don't worry so much. Despite my weird tendency to think everyone sekritly hates me, I really am not hyper-sensitive. XD

Nice? Me? Not been feeling like such a nice person lately, but thanks.

I'm typing the thing up tomorrow for you, so everyone can see what i'm referring to, and then you can tell me if I'm reading it wrong. XD

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mozart.livejournal.com

you stay busy, miss!

Baby Qui-Gon? haha, you're so strange XD

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Ahaha. Not stranger than the girl who goes and writes fic about, you know. Obi-Wan doing the grind with Xanatos.

Oh wait. That category covers me too now, doesn't it?

(The proposed fic is this little germ of an idea about what happens when baby Jedi start manifesting their powers before they've properly arrived at the Temple/when they start manifesting their connection to the Force while they're still so young that they can't be properly taught. I have this mental image in my head of a tiny ickle Qui-Gon toddling around the nursery and trying to mind-zap the droids into giving him more food and being like >:/ when it doesn't WORK like it did with Mommy and Daddy.

Uh. Can I pass this off as meta about what it's like to actually take a Force-sensitive baby away from its parents after it's already bonded with them?)

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mozart.livejournal.com

Well, if I have now broken you into Xani/Obi grindporn, maybe there is hope of getting you in on some Maul, one day ;) He probably grinds better than Obi-Wan could, anyways - or atleastt to a point that is painful and his partner would have to go, Okay,look you Sith freak - I'm raw, stop it. Which isn't to say I am not going to go write that, right now...

Wow. Just looking at your comments up above with imadra, and your reply to me, you guys comtemplate the SW universe wayyyy more than I do. I'm more like, "hee sabers are sexy" or " touch him thereeee, Xani..". The politics of Star wars almost bores me, I wish it didn't, because there are some really good, detailed stories out there, but if I know smut aint' coming, I can't complete a story. It's a character flaw - I'm a pervert. :/ (Which is probably why I haven't made headway into my next part on our Qui-Gon saga. The idea of no cock-shots has baffled me into writer's block) XD

But anyways, your idea sounds adorably cute ^_^ I like how you want to explore all of these different angles of Qui-Gon's life & development - that's character love.

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ffha ahahhaha. Come on. Can't you pretend that there is Q/O porn a-coming? Dooku and Xanatos so totally wanted to get it on with Qui-Gon; why not Obi-Wan? Can't you imagine the hair-cutting scene? Or Obi-Wan watching Qui-Gon get ready for bed at night and then tiptoeing off to msaturbate furiously?

Or, you know. Since Obi-Wan is the one person in Qui-Gon's life so far who isn't going to DIE or TURN TO THE DARK SIDE, he can also be the one who gives it up. *_* I would totally love to see big broken-nosed Qui-Gon hitting it to ickle, guilt-torn Obi-Wan to convince him to shut up.

In short, I want you to write your section even though I, myself, have not had time to write. ^_^

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I have this mental image in my head of a tiny ickle Qui-Gon toddling around the nursery and trying to mind-zap the droids into giving him more food and being like >:/ when it doesn't WORK like it did with Mommy and Daddy.

GLEE! I can just imagine his tiny little toddler frown. God, that must be half the reason people are willing to give the Jedi their kids. Can you imagine trying to wean a toddler who can do mind-whammies?

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Seriously.

I mean, we know that the ability to use the Force shows up pretty early because all of those tiny little Initiates are getting training, and you could always argue that people can't use the Force without training except in super-special circumstances like Anakin, but -- man, I imagine that on swingthrough 2, when the Jedi have let the parents keep the demon-baby for a few more months, they get a very, very, very good response rate. XD

I wonder what the incidence of Force-sensitivity is in the Republic at large. It varies by species, I know, but I'm curious. Given the size of the Republic and the number of Jedi, either the incidence of Force sensitivity is damn tiny or the washout rate is pretty high.

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man, I imagine that on swingthrough 2, when the Jedi have let the parents keep the demon-baby for a few more months, they get a very, very, very good response rate

Word.

Also, it makes me wonder if Qui-Gon's surname is "Jinn" because the people on his homeworld thought he *was* a djinn. If my nephew could mind-whammy people at his age ('all your dumptrucks belong to ME!'), I'd certainly be wondering if he was possessed.

I wonder what the incidence of Force-sensitivity is in the Republic at large

Force-sensitivity strong enough to qualify for Jedi-hood is pretty damned rare. Given the Order is 10,000 individuals, from a thousand worlds (rough estimate of the Republic's size, and really includes all the planets and space stations in a star system), that's 10 individuals per world. If there are 5 billion people on a 'world', then the incidence is about 2 Jedi/billion individuals.

Of course, you do have to wonder about the wash-out rate for candidates -- either ones who the Council rejects out of hand (Anakin) or who don't get apprenticed before the cut-off date (almost Obi-Wan, according the EU) -- and the life expectance of a field Jedi. The demographics of the Order almost certainly skews young compared to Republic society as whole, because to the danger of field operations, and winnowing process that the students go through.

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baby Qui-Gon toddling around and raising hell from neotoma

I gave you a plotbunny! hee!

You know... Dooku can't be much more than fifteen years older than Qui-Gon... there's a lot of room for play there.

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*falls out of chair*

Hi, the idea of young Dooku meeting evenyounger Qui-Gon is entirely too interesting and funny and cute for words. I mean. O.O

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Because of course Padawan (or new Knight) Dooku is just not used to toddlers. Especially toddlers who are strong in the Force and have figured out the mind-whammy. Given that my nephew could sign for 'food', 'more', 'milk' and 'all done' at the age of 18 months, and would do it pretty emphatically, I bet searching for Jedi-candidates is one of those hell-assignments that young Knights get to season them.

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teldreaming.livejournal.com

The official difference is 10 years, with Dooku becoming a knight at 20 and taking Qui-gon as a padawan that year.

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Hm. How does that square with Anakin being the youngest human Knight in about a jillion years? Is Dooku not human or something?

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teldreaming.livejournal.com

Don't know where that's from, so no idea.

But Legacy of the Jedi has Dooku taking Qui-gon as a padawan at 10, and Dark Rendezvous has what seems to be a pre-Trial conversation with Dooku and Yoda when Dooku is 20, and the Databank has them born 10 years apart. So it all works out to 20. Sort of.

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Doesn't that mess up the fanon idea of "Obi-Wan was really too young to take Anakin on as Padawan" then?

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hlglne.livejournal.com

And here I though there was too much Qui/Obi in the universe already...Ma'am, you have such a completely fresh take on the man-mountain. I wuvv you. And if it has Dooku, it's triple good.

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