(no subject)

[quigonejinn]

Freedom Hangs Like Heaven.

Iron Man set to Iron and Wine.
20MB, XviD or play in VLC

I'm going to end up recutting this when the DVD comes up because right now, there's this CERTAIN SCENE where SOME FUCKING DOUCHEBAG decides to HANG HIS FUCKING HAND off the side of the CAMERA and then some other asshole walks across andf;lkjgdf. I couldn't figure out a way to cut around it, so that scene sucks. And there's one bit where Rhodey is a talking head, but I figured that I've wasted a week of my life already on this.

So yes. Iron Man and Iron and Wine with Calexico production. And just ignore the fact that they use the wrong reign/reins on that Forbes cover. XD

Comments

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[dafnap.livejournal.com]

Ahahaha, WORK. I KNOW THE FEELING. Or I would, if I was actually doing any. I'm pretending this is my lunch break, and then I'm leaving, like, at eight to make up for all the time I've spent wanking on the internets about Tony Stark's crazy hot emo eye-twitching. (IT'S WORTH IT)

And from the Stripper Pole interlude on the plane, we know that Rhodey really, really loves and talks about it like it's his girlfriend and his family and his cultural history, all in one.

YES. That's one of my favorite parts about Rhodey - he feels as strongly about the military as Tony does about making things explode. Tony doesn't yet realize people are capable of feeling just as strongly about a stance completely opposite to his, and being equally right, because his entire world and the people in it, for as long as he can remember, literally revolved around him: Obie watched over him, Rhodey looks out for him, and Pepper works for him. He doesn't yet know how to live in a world where that isn't always the case and boy is it fun to see him struggle.

RDJ does that subtle thing with his features and then lifts his chin, it just kills me. It kills me dead.

That was pretty much how I spent my second re-watch, and I think we should turn it into a drinking game: every time subtle acting gets all up in my superhero movie's business, I'll take a shot, because yes. I pretty much go on ad nauseum at work, but I really think that's what sets Iron Man apart from most other superhero movies aside from X-Men, the characters feel like they have actual interiority. When Rhodey finds Tony in the desert, and he brings his hand up, but then lets it drop out of frustration, out of helplessness, out of joy, your heart breaks. Or when Pepper and Tony are on the dance floor, and there's a brief moment where their eyes just sort of fix on each other, like they're trying to read the truth there because they can only seem to talk around everything they really want to say, and it's gorgeous and subtle and sweet and it's like DAMN. Real actors chosen not because they can fill a suit or pad out spandex nicely, but because they can actually emote, and fill the silence with as much meaning as dialogue and explosions! Who'da thunk it?

Iron Man is a good film that just so happens to be about superheroes, and not the other way around for once, it feels good, man.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[gabby-silang.livejournal.com]

UMMMM HI YOU GUYS THIS WAS TOTALLY MY REPLY THREAD. When I last looked last night. SHEEZ.

Um, anyway, I demand that every fic y'all have explicitly described or hinted at be written, and now. And add to it a moment about when Tony's doing his coming off the plane thing and the doors open and for a moment Pepper just sees him sitting there in the wheelchair, a freaking wheelchair, and she isn't sure she can handle it, but then, by God, he gets up and tuts his chin and he's going to be okay. He's going to be different.

And then all the Obi stuff.

Least of all how he's gotta be asking when Obediah decided to kill him. And whether Obediah had anything to do with that car crash.

I think I had, like, one line in Posthuman with Tony wondering if his father could have been involved in Obidiah's under the table deals, and that whole history freaking FASCINATES me. Partially because he'll never know, and therefore we get to play around with every possibility ever. Maybe Tony was groomed from the start to be the dimwitted face of Stark Industries, the guy who could say, with a straight face, USA USA USA, and keep the spotlight so that the real business could continue. Or maybe Obidiah cut the break line. Maybe Tony helped build the car they were driving in.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[dafnap.livejournal.com]

UMMMM HI YOU GUYS THIS WAS TOTALLY MY REPLY THREAD. When I last looked last night. SHEEZ.

JOIN US. IT'S NICE AND TOASTY/ANGSTY UP IN HERE.

Maybe Tony helped build the car they were driving in.

Um. YES. I have shite memory, do you remember what they said in the beginning of the film? At what ages Tony built his first circuit, engine, etc.? Or am I misremembering? I had an aborted "Pepper Quits" (I have a whole FILE. It's labeled "Tony Is An Ass" and it makes me warm every time I see it in my google docs) snippit where Drunk!Tony throws his accomplishments in Pepper's face when she dares point out that maybe one man with a shiny suit can't solve the entire mid-east crisis alone, and he just ends up being petty and as human as Pepper just pointed out he was. I love Petulant!Tony, what can I say.

Maybe Tony was groomed from the start to be the dimwitted face of Stark Industries, the guy who could say, with a straight face, USA USA USA, and keep the spotlight so that the real business could continue.

Duuuuude, I didn't even think of that, that Obie agreed to Tony being the head because he thought he was easily manipulated and a little stupid--

(sidenote: typing with one hand, having deep thoughts, and eating carrots with a fork = Massive. Fail. Ewwww slimy veggies all over the keyboard.)

--and like quigonejinn pointed out, Tony ends up being the real deal, screwing up the plan, and forcing Obie's hand.

I love that idea that Tony will never truly know, that the threat that one possibility is that Obie didn't kill his parents, but just by being around Tony long enough makes people come to hate him enough to want to/try to kill him. It's gotta be a TERRIFYING thought for Tones, and would echo into how he approaches his relationships with Rhodey and Pepper and EVERYONE EVER. Except for Jarvis, he knows exactly what makes Jarvis tick, because Tony coded him himself.

God. My brain. Is broken. You people are making me think. During a work day. Have you no SHAME?

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[quigonejinn.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty sure it's first circuit board at four, first engine at six, I think. A shot of him with Bill Gates accompanies the circuit board, and the shot of Tony with Daddy on the motorcycle for the engine.

BEHOLD, THE POWER OF OBSESSIVE VIDDING. But yeah, whatever time scale you use, Tony has got to be competent of working on a car by the time he's nineteen.

There are angst shoals for either answer to whether he worked on the car or not, really.

Also, aldkjf how did I miss that in your fic, gabby_silang? Oh man. I can totally see it making Tony sit bolt upright in the middle of the night.

And on top of that, the idea of Dad basically thinking that Tony was just going to be useless fluff breaks my heart on a level I can't even articulate. I mean, it's pretty clear that Tony idolizes Dad on a level that he can't even articulate -- what's that thing he says? I never got to ask Dad about it. As if Dad has the definitive answer to one of the most significant questions of modern ethics.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[gabby-silang.livejournal.com]

Drunk!Tony throws his accomplishments in Pepper's face when she dares point out that maybe one man with a shiny suit can't solve the entire mid-east crisis alone

OH MY EFFING GOD. I can see this so vividly. And he ends up SPITTING and then he's printing off his own Wikipedia page and leaving it on her desk, and goes from, like the Apogee to how many jager bombs he can do in five minutes and how long he can go without sleep because to him that actually DOES mean that he should be able to save the world. Why not? There hasn't been something he couldn't do before.

Okay, taking that into account, I cannot see how movieverse Tony is not dead within at least three years after Iron Man.

Tony ends up being the real deal, screwing up the plan, and forcing Obie's hand.

And isn't it so telling how Obi (I spell it like the Kenobi, yes) totally didn't see that coming? I love his manner in the scene just after Tony's returning press conference, and arm slung over his shoulder, talking to him like a kid, and you can see Tony take on that role of the kid who'll let himself be herded, just stepping into that easily, letting Obi take care of things even though he feel so strongly about this one thing, still Obi's got that pull over him.


but just by being around Tony long enough makes people come to hate him enough to want to/try to kill him

I don't think we (WE THE INNER IM FANDOM CABAL) have even begun to touch on how unimaginably furious he must be, deep, steaming down there. A teenage kind of anger when you realize the world isn't the way you thought it was, that you can't have everything, that you have to get a job, that your parents aren't rich, that they're flawed and sometimes awful, that you yourself can and have hurt people, that other people hurt you for no good reason and the universe doesn't care. Everything was a lie and he's got to be so, so, deep down pissed.

And now he has a big metal suit with rockets on it.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[dafnap.livejournal.com]

and you can see Tony take on that role of the kid who'll let himself be herded, just stepping into that easily, letting Obi take care of things even though he feel so strongly about this one thing, still Obi's got that pull over him.

GOD SO TRUE. He just looks like a beaten down puppy, with his lame arm and all the scratches, and GOD. It must feel nice having someone take care of you after those 3 months, because like quigonejinn pointed out, Obi (now you have me doing it too, dammit) is as close to a father as he's going to get and after being unable to save Yinsin, having someone take care of this one thing has to be nice, having that chance to rest, even for a moment. Because Tony thinks he can only get just moments, because Tony thinks he's too smart (but in reality, just too stubborn) to let his guard down, because he fully believes no one can really think on his level, no one can see the whole picture, despite time and time again Tony gets into the scrapes he does because he can't do exactly that.

I want Movieverse!Tony to meet Mr. Fantastic, if only so he can see his sort of behavior from the outside. Also, because I can see Tony throwing a complete snitfit after a meeting with Mr. Fantastic at SHIELD, and Pepper looking up from her blackberry and smirking so fucking hard that Tony warns her that her face might freeze that way.

sidenote: I was just thinking about this the other day, how there are very little women super-geniuses in the Marvel U. DC has Oracle, Dr. Light (the girl one, not super-fin rapist dude) but Marvel U has...I can't think of any other than Sue Storm for a brief moment in the Ultimates universe (under Ellis, Millar came on and Sue Storm turned to porn face instead of science.) That kinda depresses me, yo.

A teenage kind of anger when you realize the world isn't the way you thought it was, that you can't have everything, that you have to get a job, that your parents aren't rich, that they're flawed and sometimes awful, that you yourself can and have hurt people, that other people hurt you for no good reason and the universe doesn't care. Everything was a lie and he's got to be so, so, deep down pissed.

And now he has a big metal suit with rockets on it.

I'm pretty much in love with that whole paragraph, just so you know, because YES. YES. Because if Tony was a 13 year old girl, he'd hang outside of the mall's Hot Topic and write deep poetry about how no one understands his pain, and he wears black so people will know the color of his sooooul.

But seriously, after Gulmira, and during the Iron Monger fight on the freeway, the potential for collateral damage was so crazy high, I couldn't wrap my brain around Rhodey letting Tony continue as Iron Man. It's not just that he's not formally trained, it's that he's not wired to actually see people as people. For god's sake, he has his suit differentiate between enemies and civilians. It's terrifying the thought of that kind of guy with that sort of weaponry trying to prove to the world that he's good by blowing shit up.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[gabby-silang.livejournal.com]

It is both totally believable and totally hilarious that in, let's say ten years' time or so, Tony will be Director of SHIELD. And his big crazy brain and his proto-soul as I think quigonejinn put it elsewhere, will have all that and a bag of HELICARRIER aimed at everything he thinks is wrong with the world. Oh fuck, Tony. It's not him who's lucky he has Pepper. It's the rest of the world who should thank GOD he has her.

It's terrifying the thought of that kind of guy with that sort of weaponry trying to prove to the world that he's good by blowing shit up.

ESPECIALLY terrifying because Tony is the kind of person who will never believe anyone really actually likes him. Just that maybe they like the version they've seen on tv, or on the cover of a magazine, or the guy they read about in Forbes, or maybe they like his haircut or the line of his suit, maybe they like his way with the ladies, maybe women like him when he's naked or when they're naked on his expensive sheets, on the hood of his expensive cars, spread out on his expensive carpets, but nobody really likes him. He'll think that, and then have no idea who the guy he really wants them to like is. What he's like. So he'll try to build it. Again.

You are totally right about girl geniuses. I think. Off the top of my head. Also, at WisCon, I was on this Buffy panel and realized the other thing that both the big two don't have is a superheroine with a kickass origin story. I mean, big blockbucker superhero movie, and big bestselling books are all about a hero and their origin story and how awesome it is. But the ladies, we are lacking in that. Therefore I plan to come up with one or two. This idea is TM me, no stealing.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[besyd.livejournal.com]

Okay, I just couldn't keep quiet. (I'm feeling like I've just found my people!) You don't know me, and you may not even want to friend me back (because seriously, if ya'll can have this kind of freaking awesome discourse about IM, you all must be on my flist), but I just have to dip in and speak because I ... I can't stop myself.

Maybe Tony was groomed from the start to be the dimwitted face of Stark Industries

Oh, I think definitely this. I think Obediah quickly, deftly, and purposefully stepped into Dad's shoes. Of course he provided love and comfort to the grieving son ... but he also started providing everything needed to induce/feed any and all addictive tendencies in an emotionally-damaged, immature young man (booze, sex, gambling, you-name-it). Because what better way to control Tony? What better way to prevent him from ever actually maturing ... keeping him the "boy genius" who was satisfied with playing with his "toys": the engineering feats that made SI shareholders rich and the addictions that kept him in line.

And it worked. Until Afghanistan. Until Tony, in his mid-30's, did in 3 months what should have happened at a younger age over a longer period of time ... he "matured". He came back a changed man (though still and even more so messed up) ... to an unchanged world. He unwittingly fell into old habits (the whole sinking gratefully into Obie's care and embrace before the press conference) but expecting something different, something that fit his new "reality".

The first real kick was Rhodey's rejection in the hangar. Totally blind-sided Tony. Like a kid who's best friend had been happily playing with him one minute and then slapped him, made fun of him, and kicked him out of the treehouse the next. Serious ow.

And then he actually "saw" Pepper for the first time. Fell into his old habits of stalk-and-acquire. But his old habits didn't sit right with his new self, though he didn't consciously realize it. I loved the scene on the balcony where Pepper succumbs to his unholy magnetism and leans in for the kiss, but he's the one who stands there like a deer in the headlights, not jumping on the opportunity (like normal). Then gratefully running away to get drinks while trying, on some level, to process what in the hell had just happened ... and then the photos. Getting ripped from his confusing "new" world to be thrown with PTSD-intensity back into captivity/survival world.

Finally, he puts two and two together, which intensifies the conflict and confusion in his head and tosses in an increasing dose of pain. And then Obie tells him the truth. With a no-longer-caring "embrace" ... in a mean, ugly voice ... and with eyes that no longer try to hide his true feelings for this stupid child-in-a-man's-body who had always been a nuisance and had now actually messed with Obediah's world. "Bled out" is such an accurate description of Tony's shock.

Can I just say now that when Obie called him "a little prick" later, my heart hurt a lot. I can imagine that some part of Tony probably didn't care if the blast from the reactor killed him (Tony).

[sighs heavily] Thank you for letting me join, if only for a moment.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[quigonejinn.livejournal.com]

DEAR GOD. DID YOU JUST WADE THROUGH THAT ENTIRE THREAD OF CRACKFACEDRY?

where Pepper succumbs to his unholy magnetism

Ahahah. Yeah, that's a good way to put it. Either gabby_silang or dafnap in Son of Uberthread over on dafnap's LJ pointed out that in that scene, it kind alooks like he has his hand on the bare skin of her back. Tony Stark transmits lust by touch, yo.

Can I just say now that when Obie called him "a little prick" later, my heart hurt a lot.

GOD. As you have probably figured out from this thread, I could write 1MM fics about how betrayed Tony felt by Obediah doing that. God. It's. Words fail me for how much I love Tony Stark's daddy issues. :D

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[besyd.livejournal.com]

Um ... I think I shall plead the Fifth. [coughs]

it kind alooks like he has his hand on the bare skin of her back

I keep staring at that scene (heh), and I just can't decide. But in my book, the man can quite probably transmit orgasms by touch. (Did I just say that out loud?)

Words fail me for how much I love Tony Stark's daddy issues.

Oh, I'm right there with ya. (And do let me know if you need a beta for those fics ... I come with references. -g-) But I find it fascinating that he locked Obie out of his Mark II suit project from the get-go. (While Fic Bunny #47 is Tony explaining the suit thing to Pepper.) Methinks that on some level (and probably all along) Tony knew he was being handled and always rebelled against it.

One of the notes I took last night was "Prodigal Son". Which leads me to think he not only grieved but he bolted after his parents' deaths. Money bets that Obie reeled him back in, probably pouncing on and ramping up whatever piqued Tony's interest at that age and in that rebellious state. And probably hated every little bit of "pandering" he had to do because he needed Tony - Tony's genius - to build his own fortune and power. I think it was probably never about Tony. And it may never even have been about Dad.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[quigonejinn.livejournal.com]

. I think it was probably never about Tony. And it may never even have been about Dad.

SHIT. SHIT.

OF COURSE. YOU ARE BRILLIANT.

I mean, I'm not sure if I'm totally convinced that Tony only came back because of Obediah since I read Tony as having such a THING about Dad's Legacy and, also, because underneath the playboy good times, Tony is kind of an obsessive workaholic. (You've just spent three intense-ass months, welding for dear life, in a cold cave. What do you do on returning to civilization? Get a cheeseburger, have a press conference, and then go back to a better equipped cave. With cheeseburgers.)

But yeah. You're absolutely right that it makes complete sense that Obediah had to hold off on whacking Tony/why he had to include Tony despite probably wanting to keep alllllllllll the power for himself -- Tony is the brains behind the operation. He's the Stark behind Stark Industries. It'd be like Berkshire Hathaway without Warren Buffett, but if Berkshire Hathaway where a tech company desperately dependent on innovation for its business model and if Warren Buffett were like the second coming of Niels Bohr and miracle year Isaac Newton all in one.

MAN. BRILLIANT.

The other major lightning bolt re: Obediah that hit this morning was obsession_inc up above talking about the probable age difference between O and Howard Stark. I mean, going by moive-canon, he had ot have been about 15 years younger. It's totally conceivable that he expected to be handed the power if/when Howard retired or died. But no, the controlling interest goes to TONY, the scapegrace son.

God, I love this stage of fandom. :D

And re: beta'ing. Thankee very much kindly for the offer. I'm a ready, fire, aim kinda approach (like Tony! only with less genius!) so none of my fics get beta'd. Ever. I'm way too impatient. If you ever have suggestions or comments or "uh, that's a really embarrassing typo" after the fact, though, totally leave me a comment or whatever. :D

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[quigonejinn.livejournal.com]

Poor gabby_silang. She's going to come on the Internet and find fourteen million comments between us about the symbolic import of Tony Stark's facial hair selection. AND we'll be fired! For totally sucking at this whole work thing!

Tony doesn't yet realize people are capable of feeling just as strongly about a stance completely opposite to his

That would probably make his head explode. No, seriously, it would. I don't think his moral education has prepared him for that at all, and if anything, having Obediah as his first real battle as Iron Man is only going to make it harder for him to think of people who disagree with him as being legitimate. I mean, dude, Obediah was pretty much a Tony Stark Soul Destroyer Special. If you want to make sure a dude sees stuff in black-and-white, with-me-against-me, it's hard to think of a first confrontation that'll do it more than something where the villain is not only out to kill the guy and people he loves pregent what he wants to do, but he's even fucking with Stark's sense of identity.

really think that's what sets Iron Man apart from most other superhero movies aside from X-Men, the characters feel like they have actual interiority

Oh, I'm willing to say that Iron Man blows every single other superhero movie, ever, out of the water when it comes to interioricity. I love Singer's X-men with a deep and true passion and furious passion, but even Patrick Stewart and Ian McKellan end up being the sum of their superhero spandex.

And I don't even like Gwyneth Paltrow.

OH LOOK, gabby_silang just showed up to spank us for littering all over her inbox.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[dafnap.livejournal.com]

She's going to come on the Internet and find fourteen million comments between us about the symbolic import of Tony Stark's facial hair selection.

I'm pretty sure she's into the same flavor of pain as we are,

Oh, I'm willing to say that Iron Man blows every single other superhero movie, ever, out of the water when it comes to interioricity.

Oh thank god, because I swear I think it's pretty much my favorite superhero movie (and movie, but I have little to no taste when it comes to actual film, so we'll just pretend I didn't type that, kay?) ever, and people keep throwing Batman Begins in my face, and I'm like "REALLY? THIRTY MINUTES JUST TO PICK A PURPLE FUCKING FLOWER?" and this is coming from a girl that sports a DC comics pin on practically every article of clothing she owns (you work in a comic store long enough, suddenly everything you own suffers the same fate.)

BB was fun, sure, but the script was as weak as most of the supporting cast and films need to be a group effort. Iron Man across the board was fucking top. notch.

And I don't even like Gwyneth Paltrow.

I KNOW, RIGHT? I never expected Pepper Potts to be one of my favorite parts of the film. I'm ashamed to say, but I've been burned by how they handle the female protagonists in superhero films to many times before, I wasn't going to give her a chance. And now I've got like 20 pages of back-story fic all because G-Pat won me over with her little grin-toe-heel spin with the espresso cup in her first scene. Cripes.

If you want to make sure a dude sees stuff in black-and-white, with-me-against-me, it's hard to think of a first confrontation that'll do it more

I didn't even think about that, how the conflict with Stane might practically imprint that sort of automatic response in Tony. That's going to be so fucking frustrating for his friends, when already trying to get Tony to act normal was an uphill process before Afghanistan, now that he's playing the righteous-warrior angle it can't get any easier. Dealing with true believers is always a bitch, but a true believer in a high-tech rocket suit? Ouch.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[gabby-silang.livejournal.com]

but a true believer in a high-tech rocket suit?

I am so in love with that. Because by that, I mean Tony. I want really badly to write something that's all about his total true-believer, old-school patriotic heart. Tony would unironically wear a US flag pin on his lapel. Tony voted for Arnold. Tony has never learned a foreign language in his life, except the bits that help him to order food, or the local equivalent of "my place or yours." Well, actually just my place. Tony never goes to yours.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[quigonejinn.livejournal.com]

STOP MAKING ME LAUGH AT WORK.

And yeah. I'm fascinated by the AU of what happens if Tony's parents never die. Presumably, Obi-wan never feels the need to get warlords to kidnap Tony. Does he ever have an equivalent experience? Is Pepper still working for him? Does he still have a relationship with Rhodey?

I mean, I can see it going both ways. If his parents never die, he doesn't have to take the weight of that legacy on his shoulders, and he can get away a lot longer with less self-questioning as a playboy 100% of the time with 115% of his soul. On the other hand, does Tony's US flag pin-wearing, Ahnold-supporting (oh God, Stark Industries probably donates to both parties, but a little more to the Repubs) stem from the need to live up to that legacy of having a dad who worked on the Manhattan Project? Does that actually stifle any questions he might end up asking himself?

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[gabby-silang.livejournal.com]

If Tony ever met someone who voted for Nader, he'd laugh, smack them across the cheek just a bit too hard to be kindly, and tell them to get a job.

Is non-orphan Tony even still a playboy? How much of that is just him, and how much is the swarm of media attention to the heir of the Starks? Would his parents let him get away with as much? Or would Tony be the forever heir-apparent, in the background in a lab coat, or maybe just grease-stained dress shirts, with goggles always dangling somewhere, with all these plans that aren't quite enough for dad to look at because, don't you know, he worked on the goddamn Manhattan Project.

Which made me think, while watching, wow, what kind of people must he hang out with that being the son of a Manhattan Project-worker has cache? In any circle I've been in, that would only bring fascinated horror and awe. Not so much, you know, the sexy.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[dafnap.livejournal.com]

Well, actually just my place. Tony never goes to yours.

I ECHO guigonejinn's COMMENT. I'm in an open air cubicle! Everyone's going to think I'm crazy! (did I mention this is just outside my cube? and it was there before I started working here? It's great at 10 o' clock at night when you're stumbling back to your cube with coffee and he's just looming there at the end of the hall)

Okay, so, we need to start a "Tony..." meme ala Chuck Norris, like:

"Tony Stark cares about the environment, that's why he insists on having his electric Hummer flown by private jet to whatever country he's currently sober enough to drive in."

Except, you know, actually funny. Like what you did.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[quigonejinn.livejournal.com]

Everyone's going to think I'm crazy!

OR THAT THEY WILL KNOW WE ARE DOING NO WORK. AT ALL. It is 6PM, and I'm still revising the same page that I was this morning. I hate all of you.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[gabby-silang.livejournal.com]

Yeah, have I mentioned I'm way jealous that you have that right there, where you can lick it ANYTIME YOU WANT. AT ANY MOMENT.

All I got right now is "Tony Stark has never touched a baby." I have no idea why.

Re: second time through = golden. i'm thinking about going time #3.

[quigonejinn.livejournal.com]

OK. I know I am preaching to the choir here, but I need to get this off my chest: I loved Batman Begins. I have loved Batman since I started sneaking TV on afternoons after school solely so that I could watch B:TAS. Imprinting on Bruce Wayne is probably why I'm nuts about Tony Stark; I'm a huge fangirl for Liam Neeson and Christian Bale and blue-eyed boys with dark hair, too.

AND YET. AND YET. BB doesn't hold a match to the SHINING COLUMN OF AWESOME that is Iron Man. It's not fair to put Pepper or Everheart against wassernameicannotremember from BB because they blow every other female superhero character out of the water except for, maybe, the ladies from the X franchise, and in that case, it's only because Jean Grey and Storm and everybody's favorite formerly-married-to-the-cute-brother-from-Full-House shapeshifter have powers that are about 10000000x more badass than anybody else onscreen. Yeah, they're cool and tough, but their identities are based on their superpowers -- not being tough, smart, professional women like Pepper and UNLOOKED FOR BONUS OF THE YEAR Everheart are. Which makes me <3 them in for fic slightly less because it's easy to be awesome hwen you control lightning bolts.

Anyways. Even if you do a Bale v. RDJ comparison, there's nothing there. I love Bale and respect his work, but he reads flat as Batman. Which isn't to say that's not the way Bruce Wayne should be played because dear God, I am first abord the "Bruce Wayne is fucked up" train, but it also means that there isn't nearly the amount of depth and nuance in his performance. You need the thirty minutes of purple flower picking to explain why Bruce Wayne is where he is; you could just start with Tony getting off the plane, and I'd still buy the rest of the movie 125%.

And that is my piece.

Re: second time through = golden. i&amp;amp;amp;#39;m thinking about going time #3.

[dafnap.livejournal.com]

I AGREE WITH THIS COMMENT SO SO MUCH.

I am the same sort of die-hard Bat fangirl, which also explains why I pinged so hard with Tony in the first place, but the difference (and this is something that makes BB so joyless for me) is that Tony doesn't take himself too seriously (even when he really fucking should. like, oh I don't know, when single-handedly trying to turn the tide of a decades long conflict that has only been made worse each time a western foreign interest has tried to do the same, Tony.) Sort of like why I sort of fell in love with the Ultimate Peter Parker - his brand of funny comes from mortal fear bordering on utter hysteria, he's funny because he's scared shitless, because he's fully cognizant of the situation he's in (this is also what the Spider-Man movie missed: the funny. but that's another rant for another time.)

Pretty much the only parts I liked in BB were when Bruce was in full on boozy playboy mode (hitting on the secretary, crashing his own birthday party, etc.) which is probably why I adore Tony Stark and Iron Man so much, it manages to be funny, sweet, and deadly serious when it needs to be, never letting one aspect overshadow the others. BB didn't do that. BB just sat there, being way too serious for a story about a dude that immediately jumps to cosplay to solve his inner angst.

That, and how perfect was the opening for Iron Man? The first shot we see is the scotch glass, that touch of class incongruous with the military surroundings, setting off just how out of touch Tony Stark really is from the rest of the world.

...

We're all going to be fired, aren't we?

Re: second time through = golden. i&amp;amp;#39;m thinking about going time #3.

[gabby-silang.livejournal.com]

Oh, yeah. Please stop talking about Iron Man all over me. I hate that shit. Can't we talk about ponies instead?

Meanwhile, in the real world:


That would probably make his head explode. No, seriously, it would. I don't think his moral education has prepared him for that at all, and if anything, having Obediah as his first real battle as Iron Man is only going to make it harder for him to think of people who disagree with him as being legitimate. I mean, dude, Obediah was pretty much a Tony Stark Soul Destroyer Special. If you want to make sure a dude sees stuff in black-and-white, with-me-against-me, it's hard to think of a first confrontation that'll do it more than something where the villain is not only out to kill the guy and people he loves pregent what he wants to do, but he's even fucking with Stark's sense of identity.

AUJDFNVKUFGBFN ESVLCJBSCF%!!!!!!!!!!! CIVIL WAAAAAAAAAAR.

Re: second time through = golden. i&amp;amp;#39;m thinking about going time #3.

[gabby-silang.livejournal.com]

Um, okay, that didn't make sense. What I meant was HOLY SHIT you have explained to me, totally satisfactorily, Tony's actions during Marvel's Civil War. I can now sleep peacefully.

And go re-read the whole thing again, only without the headaches.

Re: second time through = golden. i&amp;amp;#39;m thinking about going time #3.

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

is only going to make it harder for him to think of people who disagree with him as being legitimate.

Which is why he needs to meet Captain America but quick -- because if anyone can disagree with Tony but still be unimpeachably legitimate, it's Steve Rogers. The man is *sincere* all the damned time.

Re: second time through = golden. i&amp;#39;m thinking about going time #3.

[amonitrate.livejournal.com]

I'm totally stepping into your conversation, linked here from your journal, just to say:

I really think that's what sets Iron Man apart from most other superhero movies aside from X-Men, the characters feel like they have actual interiority.

exactly. Yes!